Label Queen with Nathan Lee Graham

[00:00:09] Speaker A: Hello, everyone, and welcome to Label Queen. I'm your host, James Aguiar, and I am here to just sort of break down the labels that we put on ourselves, that others put on us. It's a little bit of pop culture, and of course, always we end with a fabulous guest. And I have a fabulous guest today. But before we get to that, I need to talk about something that has been on my mind, and I think it's been on a lot of people's minds for probably the wrong reasons. And I don't really say I don't like to judge things too much, even though I probably sound judgy. But the show, the program, and just like that, Sister, mama, woman, child, man, anybody who's listening, why are we subjected to this show weekly? Now, that having been said, I have watched every episode of Sex and the City. I've watched the movies, I've. Whatever, gotten through this thing, whatever you want to call it, and it is time. And I don't say this lightly because I know how hard people work. I know what it takes to make something happen. And I know there's a lot of people behind the scenes whose livelihood depends on these things. But it is time to end this, this show. And I'm saying this for a couple of different reasons. One is the obvious fact that it makes no human sense whatsoever. But there's a deeper thing here, and I think we're talking about intellectual property and what happens and what can become of that and what has become of these people, these characters that we know and love. And by the way, this is not about trying to hold on to who somebody was in their 30s. And in fact, when this show was announced, I was really excited to see how these characters did age, mature, what life choices they would have made, how their lives would look different. And to say that I am supremely disappointed is not even the case. It's just. You can't even imagine. So a lot of people are saying, oh, I love hate watching it, which I hear a lot. And I guess that's a thing. And I think they even made a reference about that on the show. And. And the thing about hate watching is, as we know, there's a fine line between love and hate. I have passed hate watching into anger watching. And anger watching is not good. Anger is not good for anybody in any way, shape, or form. But at this point, I am angry. I'm angry for the things that I cannot unsee, that they forced me to. Let's talk about Aiden in the Truck. If you know, you know I'm angry at the Miranda character, who weirdly was a lawyer, but now she has no money and she can't find a place, and she's kind of homeless. But then she has this gorgeous apartment, and she moves in with Carrie for a second, and she's like a horrible roommate, and she puts Diet Coke everywhere and eats the last yogurt. I mean, these are things that you talk about when you're in college. And then she walks around naked, and Carrie's all freaked out, and then she meets the most boring girlfriend known to men. [00:03:18] Speaker B: So. [00:03:18] Speaker A: And her alcoholism is creeping back. Now, the thing about that is you have to care about the fact that she was an alcoholic to begin with, but because this writing is so bad, she was an alcoholic for, I don't know, one or two episodes. So you don't really care that the alcoholism is creeping back. Or is it? I mean, the show is just filled with these things. So I saw an interview with the great Sarah Jessica Parker, who I do love, and I think that's why we're all watching. We love her. We love the character where she said. I think it was Howard Stern. She said, I do not watch the show. And there is where my anger came in. Now, I understand being on camera not liking the sound of your voice or not watching yourself. I get it. I don't love it either. But you are an executive producer on this show, a B. You have been with this character for, I don't know, what is it, 30 years now? I don't really know the math on it, but you gotta watch it, girl. Maybe if you watch it, you will see what we're all seeing and understand it a little better. This is an opportunity to. To make real television about real issues that women in their. Men in their 50s or 60s or beyond are going through and stopped glamming it up with these ridiculous clothes, which I get and I love, and that's why people watch. But when it's not rooted in how a character actually lives their daily life, it just looks weird. But I have a solution, because I've been thinking about this way too much. And my solution, Sarah and Cynthia and everybody else on the show, is to make it a cartoon. Make it an animated series, and the show would totally work. Cartoons a la Simpsons, although I'm sure they've been Simpsonified. But make it a cartoon, and I think it'll make sense. And I think we can. We can continue, and that probably will happen, because I don't think they're going to let this show die. And Unfortunately, I'll be there watching probably till the bitter end, but maybe it is time to let it go. So that I like to talk about the highs and the lows that I'm feeling in pop culture. That is a definite low. I taped this podcast sort of out of sequence, so I don't know if it's gonna be on when this airs or not, but I am drudging through it and really it just gets more and more absurd and terrible and shockingly bad. Shockingly bad. So I guess you can get an award for that too. But I also like to balance this with the highs, and I did. I was away recently and I binge watched, if that's term still, the new Lena Dunham series Too Much, starring Meg Stalter and Will Sharp. And I have to say, I kind of miss the girls era of television. And I know that Lena is a very talented writer and I know that it resonated with a lot of people. I didn't particularly watch it. I don't know why, maybe I was doing something else at that time. But I know that it has a rabid fan base and people love it. So I. I wanted to see this because just like the Sex and the City Girls, Lena is getting older and has a little more life experience under her belt. And I knew Lena Dunham was a good writer. I did not know she was a great writer. And I was so pleasantly happy to see such smart writing, such fully realized characters who some of them you may recognize or you don't. Of course, it's television, so it's a heightened sense of everything. And it may not resonate with you, particularly because of whatever their ages are or whatever they're going through, but it's so smart and it's such a joy and it's being sort of, I think, wrongly called a romantic comedy. I actually think it's a really, really deep exploration of identity and who people are. And I just enjoyed it from start to finish. Now, that having been said, there was one really weird scene that I don't get. I don't live in London and maybe this happens, I don't know, but there's a scene where she goes to her boss's dinner. Boss's wife is played by Naomi Watts, and I'm blanking on her boss, but it's a very famous actor and it turns into this sort of cocaine fueled freak show fest. Now, I don't know what goes on in London, but I'm pretty sure that it's violating a few human resource rules. I've never been at a boss's party where platters of cocaine are brought out. And to be honest, I didn't really know people did cocaine anymore, but I guess they do. Anyway, that was the only one scene episode where I was like, huh, does this really, really go on? And the other highlight that I wanted to talk about was Emily Ratajkowski, the model who plays Meg's ex boyfriend's new girlfriend. She is a revelation in this. She is so good and so real and not sort of. How do I put this? She's not relying on looks or her body. The character is sort of a Williamsburg hipster that is a knitting girl and she's kind of got a social media following. And yes, she's a model, but like she's also a knitter and it's a really, really great part. And I'm very happy because I love it when people defy expectations, do a great job, steal the scene, which we're going to talk about in a bit with my guest. But too much is a high for me and just like that is a real low. Let's get on to my guest, shall we? Today I'm really excited because with a lot of my guests, I don't really know them that well. I did meet this person, this wonderful person a few weeks ago. I was doing an interview for a television show that was for a cover story for LA Magazine. And we just. I don't know, he's just so raw and real and present and everything I love about creative people. Just somebody who is really doing the work, putting it in. And year after year, season after season, he just comes into his own. So today my guest is born in St. Louis, Missouri. He's an American cabaret artist. He is an actor on stage, Broadway and film and television. He's a writer, he's a director. I have in my chair the fabulous Nathan Lee Graham. Stay tuned, bitch. You look good. [00:10:36] Speaker B: As do you. Isn't it nicer when we both look. [00:10:39] Speaker A: Well and feel well, you know? [00:10:41] Speaker B: Yes. [00:10:43] Speaker A: For me that's really important. Nathan Leigh Graham. I am so happy to see you. I'm so happy to have a conversation with you. Last time we met, we were with Matt and Nathan Lane talking about Mid Century Modern. And I really. It was difficult because there's three of you. It was a very quick interview and I just wanted to kind of delve a little bit deeper into behind the label, who this label queen is in front of me. [00:11:13] Speaker B: Yes. [00:11:14] Speaker A: And before we start, I just have to go through some of your credits because they're Just really, really phenomenal. And I know people know you. And then I also feel like you're the sort of actor like, oh, that was him. You know what I mean? [00:11:27] Speaker B: Yes. [00:11:27] Speaker A: Which I love. So on stage, Broadway, we've got Wild Party, the Tony nominated Priscilla, Queen of the Desert. You did the national Touring company of Hadestown, which I also wanna talk about, which is fantastic. And then film and television. My gosh, where do we begin? Well, mid century Modern. We've got Sweet Home Alabama. We have Hitch, we have Zoolander 1 and 2. And my favorite, the Comeback. So just divine credits. And I wanna start with the Comeback because it's in the news now. It is literally coming back. First of all, what did you think when you heard it was coming back and what was your experience like on that show that people just love? [00:12:17] Speaker B: Well, people just love it now. [00:12:19] Speaker A: Interesting. [00:12:20] Speaker B: Yeah. Let's clarify. Well, you know, the general audience, the layman out there, they really just thought it was fascinating and very interesting. Right. But the inside baseball people, the showbiz people, did not like for our lives to be so, you know, on screen. Literally, like, you're letting everyone know all the inside parts and all the secrets and all the, you know, the good and the bad. [00:12:50] Speaker A: Right. [00:12:50] Speaker B: And they weren't so receptive at the beginning, which is why the second season took so long to happen. And then, of course, you know, contracts are here and there, and I wasn't part of the second season and I probably won't be a part of the third, although I don't completely know that yet. So that's that part of it. But what I will say to you is, like anything that's really special and that's before its time. Although I think most things that are happening are of its time. It's just that everyone hasn't caught on yet. [00:13:24] Speaker A: Right. [00:13:26] Speaker B: It was so special because, of course, everything's following it now. I mean, the studio just got all of these Emmy nominations, and that's basically the Comeback. I don't mean that in a bad way. I mean that in a good way. Same genre, same sort of, you know, behind the scenes sort of this sort of mockumentary style kind of thing happening. And what was so fascinating about the Comeback is that it was all scripted and everyone thought that we were improving, and that's just how good everyone was. And that's just how wonderful Lisa is. Lisa Kudrow. And so I will tell you this. We all knew it was special when we were doing it. We didn't know that it would become what it did. You know, similarly to Zoolander becoming a cult classic. We didn't know that the Comeback would be what it was, but we all knew that it was special because none of us had done anything like that. And this was the burgeoning of reality television as well. So, you know, to take a scripted narrative and then make it seem like it was just happening right before you, even though we know what reality TV is. But this was, you know, this was terrific writing. Oh, an amazing. An amazing talent. Michael Patrick King at the top of his powers. You know, just. It was just amazing, you know, to be a proud of it. And we knew it. We did know it at the time. [00:14:55] Speaker A: And let us not forget that you actually are responsible for putting Aunt Sassy in that track suit, which really became kind of the. It was like the first time when you realized, uh, oh, this is not going the way she thinks it's gonna. [00:15:11] Speaker B: Go, right, With a Juicy Couture. And the backstory to Wonderful Little Moment is that when I read for it, Lisa was in the room and she said, this is nonsense. She said, let me just read with Nathan. So I don't know if she was reading with everyone, but she got up and she said, I want to read with him. And then that was it. So that was lovely. [00:15:34] Speaker A: Well, I know the line. Do you have a juicy ass? [00:15:39] Speaker B: He says something to the effect of, well, Juicy Couture. That would. Cute colors. That would be cute. And then, you know, I'm sort of gobsmacked. Yeah, Peter. Peter, as she called me, Peter darlin. He was sort of gobsmacked, like, well, I mean, you know, a lot of us want to wear Juicy Couture, but, I mean, do you have a juicy ass? You know, so it was so fun, well, iconic. [00:16:01] Speaker A: And I'm gonna fast forward to Mid Century Modern because. [00:16:05] Speaker B: Do whatever you like. [00:16:06] Speaker A: I think what you're saying to me is this sort of idea of patience, right? You need patience with things. You need to let things marinate and sort of being at the forefront. It's not always the easiest place to be. Right. You can sort of, like, lay the groundwork, but then you gotta do the work and then, you know, let everybody else follow. Mid Century Modern has a little bit of that concept in that it's almost a throwback to a sitcom. [00:16:35] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:36] Speaker A: It's got the incredible leaders at the top of the packaging. James Burroughs and Max and David and Ryan Murphy. I mean, Will and Grace, all of the things. And then it's got all of this naughtiness, but in a sort of Three camera sitcom setup. So it feels throwback and completely forward at the same time. Let's talk about the role of Arthur, how you got it and what he means to you. [00:17:03] Speaker B: Well, it was a very easy process, and it's not ever easy. So that's why I'm saying it was easy, because it was. And Max and David were delightful. We met twice on Zoom. The first time was just to talk and see if we even liked the way we smelled. And then the second time was me having read over the material and presenting it to them, and I was presenting the material to them in the pilot script to them because they wanted to work with me. So that's a big difference between auditioning for something, you know, they wanted to work with me to get it to where they wanted it to be because they wanted me to do it. So that's a big, huge difference that I have to say to everyone, which is why the process was so easy. I was always wanted, and they never made a. And they never made me feel unwanted or like I was, you know, in front of the, you know, the gun lineup. So. And then the third was a chemistry test with the great Nathan Lane, who I just was with. We went on a companion date to see our friend Josh in his wonderful show. Oh, gosh, what is it called? Ta Da. Ta Da. Yeah, that Sam Plinkleton just directed it, and he was a triumph. So everyone goes, see? Ta Da. It was a triumph. So, yes, I had a chemistry read with Nathan. And this is the third thing, right? The two Zooms and then Nathan. Here's the thing. I wanted to have the chemistry test. Why wouldn't I want to have a chemistry test? [00:18:52] Speaker A: Did you know Nathan prior to. [00:18:54] Speaker B: No. We had met socially and, you know, drive by. But of course, I've always been a fan, always admired his work in a real way and would. And leapt at the chance to work with him. So. But at the same time, it's like, I, too, want a chemistry read because I will be 57 in September, and I too, don't want to be in a space where I. You know, it doesn't work. It doesn't work. So it was a pleasure and a joy for me to do the chemistry read with Nathan. And it actually was. He was divine. And we had a wonderful time. And I'll let Max tell you what happened after I left the room, but. Cause that's his story to tell. But it was just wonderful. And that was it. That was literally it. [00:19:49] Speaker A: So that, first of all, that's really exciting. I can Imagine as an actor, getting to the point where you're wanted, you know what I mean, and you don't have to audition. That's a wonderful feeling. So kudos to you. The part of Arthur I'm kind of particularly drawn to. Obviously he comes from the world of fashion. How closely was he patterned after Andre Leon Talley or that type of archetype that sort of inhabits the fashion world? And how did you make him yours? [00:20:19] Speaker B: Well, I'm not. I'm not. How should I say it? I am not unaccustomed to playing these kinds of roles. Sweet Home Alabama being the first where I actually played, you know, a fashion designer in Frederick, Montana. And then, of course, the first Zoolander was all about fashion, you know, even though I was, you know, Todd the assistant. But, you know, I knew about fashion and I was dripped in it. And I've worked with so many wonderful, wonderful costume designers. And it is my favorite part of getting ready for a role is to be in that room working with. I mean, it's just Laurie Eskovitz, who does Mid Century Modern, is a genius. She's a genius. So I already had sort of a lexicon, if you will, for this kind of role. And then the amalgamation of an Andre Leon Talley, a Karl Lagerfeld, you know, a this, a that, and tastemakers, I should say that too, because it's, you know, it goes the spectrum when you're talking about fashion. And I love everyone from Helmut Lang to Jean Paul Gaultier to, you know, Armani and everyone in between and all the newest, newest kids too, you know, so it's all about taste, right? And so with Arthur, I knew that. Here's a man who knows that clothing is your calling card. Clothing is your armor. Clothing is the way people, you're seen first and heard second. And it gets you in the room, it gets the conversation started. It gets people talking about you, you know, before and after the party. And it also, it also makes people feel like themselves. It makes people feel good. And it could be a lift when you don't feel good inside. So it's much more than just clothing. It is the armor human beings use to express themselves. And I knew that on an intrinsic sort of kinesthetic level, you know, as Nathan Lee Graham and then for these wonderful scripts that heighten everything and bring that wonderful sort of multicam comedy together, well, it's just very exciting, you know. Loved it. [00:23:02] Speaker A: So it's interesting because those characters that you know so well can often be very, very one note, right? It's A little bit. Right? And that's what we don't want. What I loved about this show, and I want to highlight episode five and anybody who hasn't seen it yet or if you have rewatch this show, because it's much deeper than I think the surface would allow. Episode five is Fire Island. And we talked about this a little bit in our interview. You meet a young man who is basically, for lack of a better word, almost yourself. You almost meet yourself as a young man. And that scene is so powerful because you talk to him about the future. You talk to him as a human. He is not treated like a sex toy or an object or a twink. And it's a really wonderful, powerful scene. Talk to me about that scene and the representation of gay men meeting, having a meaningful relationship, and why that scene was important. [00:24:05] Speaker B: Well, right off the bat, it was important to me to have the generational conversation because you never see it, it's never talked about, and yet it happens all the time. We do pass the torch, but we're all living in the same time period, you know? Yes. Bradley Gibson, the wonderful actor Bradley Gibson might be. Gosh, she's got to be at least. I have no idea how old he's. I'm gonna say he's at least 25 plus years younger than me. And what was so wonderful about doing that scene with him was the connection you had not only with the generational aspect, but also the black queer aspect, also the passing the torch aspect. I loved every layer of the scene because it's like you too will become whatever you become. But here are some things that I can share with you to help you along the way that you might want to avoid. And I can share them with you because I've lived, I had the lived experience to do so. And whether or not the younger person listens to you or not, it's in there, right? You've planted the seed. And that's what's so special about those kinds of moments. Particularly having that kind of moment in a bar. Right? Seated in a bar and having that kind of moment. That's what makes Mid Century Modern so special. It's like, yes, you'll have something traditional, but then we'll flip it on its head and then have this wonderful, these wonderful, intimate sort of conversations. And I loved, I loved having that. I loved having that amongst the gay community, the queer community, because you don't see us being multi dimensional and having real conversations about real things. I also like the fact that men should talk more about sex. I think that it would take out some of these taboos. It would make people feel better. You would be safer even if you knew some of the things. Women talk about sex to each other all the time. [00:26:16] Speaker A: Right? [00:26:17] Speaker B: You know, I wish men did the same thing. It would make the world a whole lot better. And it sounds. It may sound frivolous to someone, but whether you're literally having sex or not doesn't mean you don't talk about sex, you know? You know, I told my sister once, I said, you know, I haven't had sex in a long time. And I said, and I was gay way. I said I was a virgin way before I came out, you know. Well, that's not true. I came out so early, but I was a virgin. And she was like, oh, you mean you can be gay and a virgin? I'm like, yes, sweetie. You know, this was back in the day. She goes, well, what's the point? I said, well, the point is that's how I identify. That's, you know. You know, if all is still working and just not using it, you know, the car's in the garage. [00:27:04] Speaker A: That's a really interesting observation, actually. But you do bring me to a point that I wanted to make. You were born in St. Louis, Missouri? [00:27:13] Speaker B: Yes. [00:27:13] Speaker A: Honey, I feel like, and I don't know you well, I feel like you're one of these people that came out sort of fully formed. Is that incorrect, or did it take a while for you to accept who you were, to be who you were, but you feel fully formed? To me? [00:27:30] Speaker B: No, I came out fully formed with a very accepting and wonderful family. My grandparents and my parents put me in the arts as soon as I could walk. They said I was talented from the start and that that would protect me. And so that's what they did because they knew I was gay and they didn't have that word for it. They said I was different in quotes, but they knew that they wanted me protected, and they wanted me protected with people who are like me. Artistic people, if you will. And my mother said I was born at 1:16am on a Monday morning and there was tons of lightning, she said, outside, just tons of lightning in September 9th. And she said. So I knew. She called me her lightning baby. And she also called me Lon Chaney when I was a baby, because I was a baby of a thousand faces. And of course, I use my face now all the time for all of my face worker. [00:28:31] Speaker A: You're a face worker? [00:28:32] Speaker B: Yes, I'm a face worker. And a.k.a. that's called acting People, you know, when your face reacts to whatever's being said. So I was fully formed, I have to admit, and I've always maintained that, you know, whoever you are, whatever you are, become more of it. So I've just become more of whatever what I already was. Right. What I've always been. And, you know, my parents sent me to school very early, so I have no discernible dialect, so I can be very continental if I need to, just because that's how I grew up. I was in voice and speech class in grade school, for God's sake. Love that. So, you know, that's how it's gone. And I'm really, really super, super, super happy and proud and gratified by all of those experiences. And I'm very thankful to my parents and my grandparents and for loving me in that kind of way. [00:29:26] Speaker A: So amazing. And you bring up a point that I also. I talk to people a lot about. When somebody tells you something, when somebody says you have talent, when somebody says you're good at something, believe them. And a lot of times we don't. We're like, oh, no, I'm not. I'm not. I'm not good enough. I'm not. Da, da, da. But believe them. And it sounds like you. You had that sense of belief instilled really early. So kudos to your family. [00:29:53] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, you know. Yes. One part of it is you get the reaction from the people around you. Right. Oh, they're crying, they're laughing, they're enjoying what I'm doing. But the other part is these are the people you trust first. And so many of us don't look up with parents that are kind, you know, So I just happen to have a really wonderful. And they were kind to me, particularly my stepfather and my mother later. And that, you know, you just. You sort of luck up with that. But these are the people you trust first, so you believe them is my point. [00:30:36] Speaker A: I love that. [00:30:37] Speaker B: And then you sort of, you know, if it goes the other way, the negative way, you spend your life in therapy trying to get over that. But what can you do? [00:30:44] Speaker A: So fast forward to, I think, this year, maybe even last month, in your hometown, you were awarded the Vanguard Award at the Critics Choice association of LGBTQ for Cinema and Television. [00:30:59] Speaker B: That was the critics. That was the Critics Choice Award. [00:31:01] Speaker A: Love. Tell me about this. [00:31:03] Speaker B: Well, I mean, all of us were there. All of us, the wonderful people that we all love. You know, I won't even start to name because I'll leave someone out. The amount of people who won this award this year? Nathan Lane and Matt Bomer won last year. So this was the second annual Critics Choice Awards for the LGBTQ folks. And it was very exciting to be in that room with all of that talent because as I said there, all of it was worthy, all of it's valid and all of it's needed. All of the different platforms, we need all of the shows on simultaneously, right? We need the coming of age stories to happen. We need the ones that you know, where you're trying to find yourself and you're ashamed and you need shows like Mid Century Modded, where you're not ashamed at all and you've established that you are this person and you're going about your life in these different situations. So we need all of the spectrum of all the shows that are happening now. Where we may have been confused was I am about to receive another HRC award in St. Louis, that's it, in October. But I had received an earlier one in Cincinnati, so I already have an HRC Award, Human Rights Campaign Visibility Award, and I'm just lucky enough to get another one. And then the Vanguard Award was, you know, thrown in there in the Twix. [00:32:28] Speaker A: So great. You said being in the forefront and leading change, because in my army, everyone will be welcome. I'm interested that you used the word army. Talk to me a little bit about that. [00:32:40] Speaker B: Well, because we're in a war and let's not pretend we will always be in a war. The truth will always be challenged. Authenticity will always be challenged. Because fearful people want conformity. Now. No one wants chaos, but live and let live. Absolutely. And so for the things I just said, that's why we're in a war. But I am a joyful warrior. You are not going to take away my joy whilst I beat your butt, you know, so I am going to come up and slap you in the face with my kid gloves very nicely, but I'm going to slap you all the same. So I'm going to slap down your negative ideas, I'm going to slap down your prejudices, your biases. I'm the slap down, you know, you discriminating against people for this, that or the other. So while you're doing that, you cannot lose the essence of who you are. And our community, for all of its faults, and there are many like any other human beings, but what we do share, I think, across the board is joy. We are a joyful bunch and we find joy in almost anything. You know, I have my new puppy and the thought of me getting the right kind of treats was such a joyful thing. It's like, am I gonna do this? Am I gonna do that? Oh, I don't like the color of this bag. Now. What if someone sees me take this bag out of this bag? You know, is this an organic? You know, it's just joyful, though. It's not even like. It's not even neurotic. But if you want to be neurotic, sure, go ahead. It's a joyful thing, how we approach things. Because I believe that part of that is because if we didn't do that, we wouldn't survive. Right. So it's not even a put on thing. It's just that it's a superpower that we have to tap into right away in order to even get up in the morning. [00:34:45] Speaker A: Well, really? [00:34:46] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:34:47] Speaker A: To me, what you're saying also is really just visibility. And when we met, you called yourself the glamorous cockroach. Honey, that is just going to show up and work, and you're not gonna get rid of me, and I'm gonna do the job, I'm gonna do the work. [00:35:02] Speaker B: Absolutely. And I believe that that is my form of activism, because if you see me, you see my face, you're gonna know, oh, there he is again. There he is again. There he is again. Always showing up, always in something, doing something and showing up, I would say, no matter what the character is, in a positive way. You know, I could be playing a villain, but it's a very positive thing that I'm a part of whatever the subject matter is, whatever the medium might be. So that is my activism, to show up and show out all the time, everywhere. And I quite honestly want these stories, our community, queer community, the LGBTQ community, when our stories told across the board, because we are across the board. We're in every echelon of society, every boardroom, every stage, every gym, every whatever. So we're all over the place. And that's why visibility is important and representation is important. We want to be reflected all the time. [00:36:14] Speaker A: Love, love, love. Okay, we're gonna wrap things up, but two things before we go. I need to know, and this is such a sort of basic question, but to me, you embody so much, and I wanna know, where are you most comfortable? Are you most comfortable on stage? Are you most comfortable on film? In television? Where are you feeling like, oh, I'm home. [00:36:35] Speaker B: Yeah, that's hard now because I do mix it up so much. Right. So I'll go from one medium to the next, and I'm comfortable wherever I am is the real answer. You know, as a Virgo as well. The adaptable sign. The most adaptable sign. [00:36:52] Speaker A: We're both Virgos. [00:36:53] Speaker B: Yeah. Hello. Hello. But I suppose because I started on stage, that will always be my touchstone. It will always be my go to. Right now what I want to do on stage has changed. I have no energy to be the star of anything. I don't want to star in anything. I just want to steal it. That is my motto. I don't need to star in nothing. I just need to steal it. So I don't want, you know, to Hadestown. For instance, playing Hermes was a wonderful role. And it happened right at the perfect time. We were on strike, so I went out back on the road. I hadn't been on the road since Family Matters went off the air, whenever the hell that was, and we'll check it out. And so it was hard, you know. And Hermes is on stage for two and a half hours, I think he leaves the stage at the end of the second act for maybe six to eight minutes, you know, right to badoosh and bedazzle and come right back on stage. And I said to myself, after I did that, I said, I'll never do this again. I have proven to myself over and over that I can lead and do the things. Now what I want to do is maybe have one song, if it's a musical, in the first act, at the end of the first act, and then do a reprise of the same song in the second act with a modulation, and that's it. And the Tony goes to Nathan Lee Graham. [00:38:35] Speaker A: Love, love, love. By the way, the role of Ermes was originated by Andre De Shields, who. [00:38:41] Speaker B: Actually dear, dear friend. [00:38:43] Speaker A: And so I'm so happy you did that role because I do see you as an heir apparent. And also, you know, you have others coming up behind you. So it's a great role. And his Tony acceptance speech I still quote, because it is one of the best speeches ever recorded. So if you see him, if you see him, tell him I said that you have a new love in your life, and this happens really quickly. Are we able to see the little puppy? [00:39:12] Speaker B: Laven, do you want to say hello? Come on, baby. He's like, what? Come on, honey. [00:39:19] Speaker A: Talk about a scene stealer. I mean, there he is. I mean, adorable, adorable. So talk to me about Lavin. Talk to me about Lavin and why he's named that. [00:39:32] Speaker B: Well, he's named after the late, great Linda Lavin. And I originally thought that he was a Girl. Because I wanted to get a girl and name her Linda. Right? And well, I'll just tell the whole story really quickly. So I have been looking and looking for a six months and no one was adopting the black dogs. Black haired dogs. And then I found out statistically that they are adopted less. [00:39:59] Speaker A: Are you serious? [00:40:02] Speaker B: I said, wait a minute. Our neuroses and prejudices have dwindled down to this too. The dog doesn't even know what color he is. Right? It's so ridiculous. And he's gorgeous. So cute. So anyway, I thought he was a girl. He is indeed a boy. And I was like, well, what am I gonna do? And then he responded to Lavin and here we are. [00:40:27] Speaker A: Now, is it true that you actually Linda's last scene was with you? [00:40:34] Speaker B: It wasn't true. That is very true. [00:40:36] Speaker A: That is such a powerful. [00:40:39] Speaker B: Oh yeah, it's so powerful. I mean, it's not lost to me. It was the La Mer scene. And then of course her last line was white people. Am I right? So those were the very last words she said. [00:40:57] Speaker A: Working. [00:40:58] Speaker B: And that was with me. And so along with everything else that will never leave my heart and my mind. And. And she was a huge dog lover. So I said, well, I've been in the market, you know, and we were talking about me getting a dog even, you know, while she was still here. And I said, but I'm going to wait until we finish shooting and I'm going to wait till the summer, you know, when I'm back from Barcelona and London, you know, all the things. And we get through the show opening and the Emmys and all this bullshit. So, and, and here he is and he has responded to that name and I kind of like it. It's very chic. [00:41:37] Speaker A: It's so chic. I mean, it's very, very fabulous. And she is fabulous. She was fabulous. I want to bring it back to mid century modern for a second because that episode where you deal with her unfortunate and unexpected passing kind of in real time while you were shooting is also one of the most powerful episodes of the entire series. And again, I'm urging people to watch it because the way that was written with complete respect and shock and sadness, but the humor. And once again, Nathan Leigh Graham comes in with the zinger that just breaks the ice and honestly steals the show. So well done, you. [00:42:25] Speaker B: Well, the, the accolades must go to Max and David and that writer's room. My God, they wrote the hell out of that episode. Really one of the best episodes of television I've ever seen. But also a force to be a part of. And then Nathan Lane just giving a tour de force performance as well. And Matt and I just really listening and being in the episode. And I mean that literally and figuratively. It was just a wonderful episode to do because we did feel a sense of lifting Linda up. And it was not only a tribute, but a celebration to her. And it was our duty to be as fantastic as we possibly could have been. So that, you know, I guess I can just thank Linda for that, too, for making us rise to that occasion. Because it was her spirit, I call her the spiritual showrunner of the show, anyway, that made all of that happen, you know. [00:43:30] Speaker A: Right. [00:43:31] Speaker B: And then, of course, Jimmy Burrows, too. My God, Exactly. [00:43:34] Speaker A: I can't even believe that you were directed by him. I mean, it's just every episode. [00:43:39] Speaker B: Every episode. And he also did one episode as himself, I think in the Comeback. [00:43:45] Speaker A: He did. [00:43:45] Speaker B: If I'm not mistaken, he did not. [00:43:48] Speaker A: A very flattering portrayal. [00:43:53] Speaker B: But really spot on. [00:43:55] Speaker A: So, Nathan, nlg Nathan Lee, what is next for you and what are your hopes for your future short term? [00:44:04] Speaker B: Well, I've done one indie, I've got two in the pipeline, and I just signed with a wonderful French company when I was in Europe, in Paris, new management there that facilitates Americans working in Europe. And so that's what's new for me. I'm going to be working in Europe much more now and I'm so looking forward to that. You know, I really, really am looking forward to going across the pond and making all of the magic happen over there. [00:44:43] Speaker A: You are such. [00:44:44] Speaker B: And lots of little things that I can't talk about with that, but, you know, hopefully will come to fruition. [00:44:49] Speaker A: Well, listen, you continue to delight, to surprise, to engage, all of the things, and I have to say, meeting you on that quick interview was just really a highlight. And having this time with you has been fantastic. I wish you only the best. And from one label queen to another, thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much for doing this. [00:45:10] Speaker B: Have we spoken about your robe before we go out? [00:45:12] Speaker A: We have not. What do you think? [00:45:13] Speaker B: My God, it's so gorgeous. It's so divine. [00:45:17] Speaker A: So here's the thing. When I saw the trailer for Mid Century Modern, I was like, no, that bitch does not have that robe on. I know how expensive it is. I own it. And I was like, what is the wardrobe budget for these robes? Every. I mean, you guys have like 47,000 robes in this show. [00:45:37] Speaker B: We do, and I normally wear one. You know, I'm just giving you an animal print today, but. Well, I actually have an animal print robe back there. I love these silk. But we had to mention your robe because it's exquisite. [00:45:51] Speaker A: So you're exquisite in it. I think if MCM comes back for a season two, steal it. If it doesn't, go back and find it and grab it. But, honey, get it, because it looked divine on you and you are divine. [00:46:03] Speaker B: Thank you so much. What a wonderful, wonderful time I've had. [00:46:06] Speaker A: Thank you. Big kiss.